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December 04, 2008

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itsjustme

Am I missing something?

27,037 homes listed / 3,640 transactions last month

seems like a lot more than 'average number of days a home currently remains on the market in the GTA is 41'

There is almost 10 months of inventory!!

To close for comfort

I hope when I bought with 5% down last year I wasn't standing on the edge of a cliff.

lipstickonapig

John - Why is there so little attention being paid to the fundamental value of real estate? If I buy a house now and I pay fair value for it, I am less concerned if the broader market falls 10% or even 20% in the next two years...all assets including houses have price cycles that follow their long-term mean. A recent WSJ article stated that the long-term (ie. 100 year) average home price should increase by inflation plus a percent or two; meaning if long-term inflation is around 3% you should expect to earn about 5% on your home year over year over the long term. Home prices should always revert to their mean. Take a look at what happened to the average home price for the GTA in the years 1986, 1987, 1988, and 1989; they increased 27%, 36%, 21%, and 19% respectively. Way higher than the long-term mean of 5%. This was driven in part by a period of high inflation and immigration. Reversion to the mean demanded that house prices "correct" for this period of abnormal price appreciation and as could be predicted, house prices in the GTA declined over the next seven years by an average of 4%. So if you take an average of the two periods, you get 6.6% year over year increase which is still higher than the mean but can be expected given the structural shift in demand resulting from immigration patterns. So what about today? From 1997 to 2007, home prices in the GTA have increased 6% year over year. This is slightly higher than the long-term mean of 5% but not by much. So on a fundamental basis house prices in the GTA don't deserve to go through a large correction as they did back in the early 1990s...there is a big difference between a fundamental price correction and a decline in prices due to consumer sentiment. The current state of the real estate market is more related to the latter than the former. If you take a normalized Toronto home price from 50 years ago and grow that home price by 5% until today, our current home prices are only slightly above that trend line and by no mean represent a bubble. And if you think the long-term average price increase should be 6% and not 5%, we are actually under the long-term trend and one could argue Toronto real estate is fundamentally undervalued! The bottom line is there is a big difference between fundamental value and market value. John, how about some fundamental analyis instead of the "less buyers in the Winter" analysis?

simon

Lipstickonpig,

Regarding your numnbers.

The avg inflation 1997-2007 was 2% (not 3%). Thus, using your figures, the true appreciation should have been 1.04^10 (=1.48) vs the actual 1.06^10 (=1.79)

Based solely upon these numbers the price correction should be 1.48/1.79, or a drop to 82% of present values.

Personally, I think we'll see drops higher than that. But I just wanted to add in the math to your good analysis above.


=

lipstickonapig

simon - I think you have to use the 100 yr average inflation rate which is what I was using in my analysis

simon

Lipstick,

Actually, I think you're mistaken...

The historical real rate of return is 2%. Thus, that is the relevant rate (and not the 5% nominal rate which derives in part from the historically higher 3% inflation rate)

The key figure in the appreciatiion of any asset is the real rate of return net of inflation during the period the asset is held.

I'll also point out that I'm an actuary, and so the theory of interest is my area of professional expertise.

regards

Lewis

Right, so I should be totally fine no matter what, as long as I hold on to a house for 100 years.

Yeesh.

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